with all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey. >> i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. [ laughter ] >> a fierce and yes sometimes funny debate from the presidential nominees, but just how accurate were their statements? this morning we will drill down on the facts. and the space shuttle "endeavour" is on the move in los angeles. we're going to go live to the streets of l.a. that is straight ahead for you.

good morning. welcome to "early start." happy you're with us this morni morning. >> it is 5:00 a.m. in the east. >> you are working overtime. so up first here, paul ryan and joe biden battling it out in the bluegrass state, and unlike last week's presidential debate, this one had a little bit of fire. the vice president coming out swinging, ryan keeping cool and counterpunching. >> so let's go to the score cards. the cnn orc poll taken right after the debate showed 48% of the voters who watched thought paul ryan won. 44% favored joe biden. that's basically a statistical draw. senior congressional correspondent dana bash is live from danville, kentucky this morning, and dana, this was a much more spirited debate this time around, a debate with a capital "d." >> reporter: oh, it sure was. i was in the hall last night, and it was rocking and rolling from the beginning. pretty much right through the entire 90 minutes. there was some grimacing and

grinning, a lot of it actually on the left. there was some smirking on the right, but all in all it was quite a substantive debate on the central issues of the day. these were two men who both came ready to tangle. >> i don't know what world these guys are in. >> reporter: on taxes. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and preserve important preferences for middle class taxpayers. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. >> on medicare. >> if they just alou medicare to bargain for the cost of drugs like medicaid can't, that would save $156 billion right off the bat. >> and it would deny seniors choices. >> on the president's foreign poll. >> i when we look weak, our adversaries are much more willing to test us. they are more brazen in their attacks and our allies are much less to trust us. >> that's a bunch of malarkey. >> reporter: the vice president seemed determine to make up for the president's mistakes last

week, almost immediately launching the attack lines the president didn't launch in his debate. >> shouldn't be surprising for a guy who says 47% of the american people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives. my neighbor pays more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. >> before the debate cnn was told paul ryan's team anticipated biden being aggressive where the president was not, especially on mitt romney's infamous 47% remark. >> mitt romney is a good man. >> reporter: romney was reddy with a well-practiced retort. >> with respect to that quote, i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. [ laughter ] >> but i always say what i mean, and so does romney. >> reporter: biden's recovery an for a demoralized democratic base was not just in what he said but what he did. >> in spite of their opposition. >> oh, god. >> reporter: the president was criticized for not interrupting, biden jumped in constantly. >> as a result that have.

>> that didn't happen. >> mr. vice president. >> reporter: the president was slammed for nodding as romney spoke. biden used the split screen to give a running commentary of disapproval with his facial expressions. ryan had a zinger red for all that, too. >> i know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground, but i think people would be bert served if we don't keep interrupting each other. >> reporter: for 90 minutes voters saw two dramatically different visions, from the economy. >> the last people who need help are 120,000 families for another -- another $500 billion tax cut over the next ten years. >> our entire premise of these tax reform plans is to grow the economy and greet jobs. >> reporter: to national security threats, like a nuclear iran. >> and if they get nuclear weapons, other people in the neighborhood will pursue their nuclear weapons as well. >> war should always be the absolute last resort. >> reporter: for the most part it was a substantive debate between two longtime lawmakers who tried to disagree without

being too disagreeable. >> when my friend talks about -- >> reporter: biden avoided any trademark gaffes but did provide a little levity. >> this is a bunch of stuff. like, here's the sgleel what does that mean, a bunch of stuff? >> it means it's simply inaccurate. >> it's irish. >> we irish call us malarkey. >> thanks for the translation. >> dana, the stuff was certainly flying at that debate last night to quote joe biden there. a debate with a lot of substance, as we've all been remarking this morning, but also there's this discussion about style and all the interruptions certainly on the side. joe biden interrupting paul ryan, but the "new york times" this morning had an interesting point. they said there was a strategy there. they said what the democrats were hoping to do is sort of poke holes or draw attention to inconsistencies and what they say they see in the republican argument. what do you make of that? >> reporter: i totally agree. it really was -- seemed as though, we know this in even talking to some biden sources.

joe biden learned the lesson of president obama's mistakes and then some. the way that he reacted, it was he knew that camera was on him. he knew that they were going to get every eye roll and every grimace and every grin, and there were a lot of them, and -- and it was -- it was a strategy certainly to, i believe, make clear to the democratic base, since we have all been talking about the fact that there's so few undecided voters, to make it clear that the democratic ticket was still in the game. if you look at the polls and sort of talk to democrats about what the big problem was at the presidential debate last week, it was that the democrats were just demoralized, deflated, and that's why you saw some of the swings in the polls, particularly in the battleground states. >> certainly a lot of excitement. thank you so much, dana bash live for us in kentucky. both sides went into full spin mode afterward. everything was under the microscope. ryan's level of experience, biden's interruptions and his facial expressions. check it out.

>> congressman ryan was out of his depth and showed clearly that the ticket is not ready for prime time on foreign policies, and i think that was a decisive difference between the two sides. >> i thought it was a great night for us. i was excited for paul. he was solid. he had a command of the issues, and quite frankly i was embarrassed for the vice president. i mean, the laughs. we counted 82 times that joe biden interrupted paul ryan. >> if the only criticism coming from the right and from some folks out there is that he smiled too much, i'll take that any day. my father enjoyed the opportunity to debate congressman ryan on a very important issue. >> so we did not count smiles and interruptions but our expert team of producers, researchers and reporters, we have been busy all night figuring out whether the candidates were telling the truth in this debate. this hour we'll focus on two big international issues. now, right after the bat the candidates argued about the situation in libya. the vice president made the claim that the administration did not know there were requests

for more security in benghazi. >> we weren't told they wanted more security. we did not know they wanted more security again. >> that surprised a lot of people. one of the facts this week. two former officials stationed there said they had in fact asked for more security. we heard this at the house hearing on wednesday. our verdict here is unclear. it's not clear how high these requests for security got in the administration, but officials did testify the state department was asked. either joe biden didn't know this or he was flat out wrong. now, i want to move to iran right now. paul ryan claimed that iran's ability to make nuclear bombs has quintupled under president obama. >> we cannot allow iran to gain a nuclear weapons capability. now, let's take a look at where we've come from. when barack obama was elected, they had enough fissile material to make a nuclear bomb. now they have enough for five. >> the institute for science and

national security said when obama took office the iranians had enough material to make one nuclear bomb. now they have enough uranium to make five if, and this is a big if, if they have the capability to enrich the uranium, and to our best knowledge right now the iranians do not have the capability to enrich the uranium or the technology to build a bomb, so it is partially true but misleading. yes, they have more uranium, but this department says they do not believe iran can yet make a bomb out of it. you, of course, can watch the replay of the debate at noon eastern time on cnn and judge for yourself. >> how often do we say this is must-see television? it really is, right? >> this is fantastic. i was watching the replay. the clips in dana's piece. wow, every bit as i remember from last night. >> it was very good. an aide to paul ryan says "time" magazine used poor judgment when it published pictures of the vice presidential nominee pumping iron just hours before last night's debate. have you seen this. take a look. ryan does not appear presidential there. these photos showed up on

"time's" website yesterday. he claims a promise was made that they would never be published. "time's" managing editor says no such promise was ever made. >> more rallies this morning in support of a 14-year-old anti-taliban actist. the taliban targeted the 14-year-old for many a fierce critic of the militant network and fiercely advocates education and girls and women's rights. about 100 people have been arrested for allegedly colluding with the attackers who tried to assassate her. she is still in critical condition this morning. new this morning, the u.s. has a new diplomatic leader in libya. lawrence pope arrived in tripoli yesterday. he'll take over diplomatic duties in the wake of the death of ambassador chris stevens. pope came out of retirement to tage this job. he's spent more than three decades in the diplomatic ranks. >> all right. this just in to "early start."

the 2012 nobel peace prize was awarded to, drum role, the european uniion. announcement was made moments ago in norway. they were cited for advancement of democracy and reconciliation in europe for decades. the whole european union gets the award, probably the most prestigious and most well known of the world prizes so congratulations to them. >> all right. happening right now, the shuttle "endeavour" is on the move. "endeavour" embarking on its final mission, a 12-mile journey through the streets of los angeles. it will travel from los angeles international airport to its new home at the california science center. there will be plenty of time for photo ops. it's expected to take 46 hours to make that 12-mile trip. we're there with a live report for you. >> all right. if you were busy watching the debate and missed baseball. man, there was baseball last night. the detroit tigers are headed back to the american league championship series. they shut out the oakland a's 6-0 behind their ace, and he was

an ace, justin verlander. this was the decisive fifth game of the alds. you do not want to face justin verlander in a game like that. the national league's san francisco giants completed an improbable comeback with a game five win over the cincinnati reds. the giants lost first two games at home and went on to win the next three straight in cincinnati. they will now play for the pennant. meantime, justice was done. the baltimore orioles forced a fifth and deciding game tonight in the bronx beating the yankees 2-1. >> go yankees. >> in 13 innings. no, no, no, all for the orioles here. that's fact check true and finally a home run by jayson werth gave the washington nationals a walkoff win against the st. louis cardinals to set up yet another game five. so, this will be one of those cases where all four of the division series have gone the distance. in d.c. when jayson werth hit that home run, and man that place was bonkers. there was a scream everywhere. the city erupted in joy. it was worth it, you might say,

with jayson werth hitting the home run. >> ha, ha, ha. 12 minutes past the hour and from the you can't make this stuff up files. michael vick, the guy who went to jail for running dog fights, is up to something that will have you saying seriously? ide t. tomato, obviously. haha. there's more than that though, there's a kick to it. there's a pop. wahlalalalallala! pepper, but not pepper, i'm getting like, pep-pepper. it's kind of like drinking a food that's a drink, or a drink that's a food, zip zip zip zip zip! i'm literally getting zinged by the flavor. smooth, but crisp. velvety. kind of makes me feel like a dah zing yah woooooh! [ male announcer ] taste it and describe the indescribable. could've had a v8. woooo! [ laughing ] [ laughing ] [ laughing ]

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we are back. welcome back to "early start" this morning, the first and only vice presidential bate full of attacks from both sides on the economy as well as president obama and governor romney's economic plan. >> christine is here with a fact check of some of those comments found by our team of producers, researchers and reporters on two claims. you have one from each candidate. >> i want to talk first about this idea on taxes first. let's talk about taxes because paul ryan claimed last night you could have a 20% income tax rates across the board so lowering income tax rates by 20% across the board and keep the middle class tax deductions

intact. something that would not add to the deficit, they say. here's -- let's listen to paul ryan saying that. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and still preserve the important preferences for middle class taxpayers. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. >> they have been arcing about this for months now. the non-partisan tax policy center says given the information that is available from the romney/ryan campaign it is not possible to cut tax rates as much as you'd like without eliminating deductions that may hurt the middle class. specifically, you can't do this without changing rules on capital gains taxes, dividend taxes and the romney campaign has said they will not do that. you cannot cut taxes and keep the middle class deductions and can't cut taxes and keep lower rates on capital gains. now the romney campaign has said, look, we would work with the congre. we would -- we can't tell you what exactly it would look like because we'll work with the congress but the tax policy center says it can't be done.

given what we know, it can't be done. the second claim, let's talk about the auto bailout, fight begun this on the campaign trail. vice president biden made the case that romney would let detroit go bankrupt. listen. >> we knew we had to act for the middle class. we immediately went out and rescued general motors. we went ahead and made sure that we cut taxes for the middle class, and in addition to that, when that occurred what, did romney do? romney said, no, let detroit go bankrupt. >> and that he literally let detroit go bankrupt. on november 18th, 2008, mitt romney wrote an op-ed on detroit. romney never used the words in those piece and he argued for the managed bankruptcy. a managed bankruptcy may be the only path to the fundamental restructuring the industry needs. in a monked bankruptcy the federal government would propel newly competitive and viable automakers rather than seal their fate with a bailout check. and the obama administration ultimately had a managed

bankruptcy of the automakers so the romney op-ed titled "let detroit go bankrupt," that was a "new york times" headline. romney wanted a managed bankruptcy, but -- but, john, you say he has actually said these words. >> the obama campaign sent me a video over night of him saying it in 2011, well after the bailout happened. he actually spoke the words let detroit go bankrupt, actually quoting the headline from that. so they are trying to say the words came out of his mouth, albeit not before the bailout or not when he's advocating for it. >> the difference here is mitt romney did not want a direct injection of taxpayer funds into the companies as they were, right? >> that's exactly correct. >> in the end you didn't get a direct injection of taxpayer funds into the company, right, because the white house and the car czar was remaking these things through the bankruptcy. >> there was a bailout and managed bankrupts net end. >> so the final verdict. >> the final verdict on this one is that it is false, that it is false that -- that he just said let it go bankrupt.

it's got more nuances to it. >> all right. thank you, christine. >> it is official. moving on to some other news right now. michael vick owns a dog. this revelation comes three years after the philadelphia eagles quarterback finished serving a prison sentence on dog fighting charges. in a state vick says the dog is well cared for, and he wants his children to develop a healthy relationship with animals, so that happened. >> there's no more information on that either. people are trying to figure out what kind of dog did he buy. he said this is reeling' chance at redemption, letting my kids to have this opportunity to have what most families have. coming up, the "endeavour" shut s&l almost at its new home. we have live pictures for you. take a look at that. we're following the path all morning. is it moving? look -- it is a very slow move, but they tell me it is moving through the streets of l.a. all morning. it's being towed. listen to this, by a truck, a toyota tundra truck. we're going to show that to you as well.

how is that even possible? i don't know, but we're going to ask john zarella, all of these questions and so much re in a live report. that is coming up next.

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[ male announcer ] get more access with the citi card. [ crowd cheering, mouse clicks ] welcome back to "early starstar start." take a look at your screen. you're looking at a live picture of shuttle "endeavour" on a slow roll through the streets of l.a.

ebb route to its home at the california science center. they are making the 12-mime center from l.a.x. at two miles an hour. a very slow roll. giving l.a. commute ears new excuse for being late for work today but it's an awesome one, a space shuttle jam. cnn's john zarella is watching it all for us. he is live in los angeles. so john, i understand right now it's moving very, very slowly, and i understand at some point a toyota tundra is actually going to be moving this giant enormous shuttle. how is that even possible? >> yeah, well, we'll find out later tonight when they actually hook up across the street. the shuttle is just leaving los angeles international airport. they are dubbing this mission 26. the shuttle flew 25 times, through a hubble space telescope servicing mission, recovered

satellites in orbit, but this is certainly its shortest trip it will ever make, 12 miles, its slowest trip. it's going to take 46 hours over two days, but, zoraida, this is probably going to be the most fascinating journey any space shuttle has ever made. right now it is on top of a transporter which is self-powered, and they are pulling it through the streets here of leaning. they are coming up to mcconnell avenue where they will take a right turn on mcconnell. they are going to make several stops along the way as they reconfigure the shuttle. one point from a wider carrier, to a lighter carrier and over to a wider system to get over the bridge at the 405 where they will use a toyota truck, so today they will make a couple of stops. one for four or five hours and another stop overnight for seven or eight hours. >> wow. >> and authorities are asking people, look, we know you want to come out and see this.

this is just an incredible, most incredible site, you know, that folks will ever have an opportunity to witness here, but tomorrow is the big day. tomorrow there are going to be ceremonies and festivities. one over at the old forum. another at an area shopping mall. before they actually get to the california science center. right now, zoraida, i'm looking at the back wing of the shuttle just passing me. remember, this is 78 feet wide, over 100 feet long, and they had to take down power lines to move it, really delicate. >> john, what is that comparable to when you talk about the size of this. can you compare it to something to put it in perspective for all of us? >> like about a 737 jetliner, but it weighs -- the shuttle alone right now ways about 150,000 pounds. now, tom, if you can cut back here, the back end of the shuttle, zoraida there, you can

see the nozzles there where the main engines would be. the main engines have been removed from the shuttle because nasa hopes at some point to use the three main engines, so behind those cones there are no main engines, so that reduces a little bit of weight. some of the avionics has been taken out, but beyond, that you know, it's absolutely, you know, identical. it is the space shuttle, as pristine as they could possibly deliver it to the museum. you know, zoraida, a lot of people were saying why don't they take the wings off. that would make it easier. underneath the wings there, thousands of thermal tiles. there's the leading edge skin on the top, the thermal blanketing for re-entry. he would have to cut through all of that, remove the tiles, and, you know, it's like humpty dumpty sat on the wall. there would be nobody that would be able to put it back together again if they ever attempted to just actually tear it apart >> you know, you mentioned

something earlier, and that was they actually tore down trees and light poles in order to be able to allow this journey to happen. >> yeah. >> didn't some people get upset about that? >> oh, yeah. there was somewhat of an outcry here, without question, and the california science center has promised that for every one tree that they had to take down. now the shuttle is stopped here. they are at this intersection at mcconnell, but for every one tree they had to take down, and there were more than 250, that they are going to replant two trees, so that at least, you know, it was some consolation to the folks here, and, yes, light poles had to come down. street signs had to come down because, you know, the tail section of the shuttle is way higher than a lot of street intersections there, but, again, a very, very slow journey over the next 46 hours. a couple of stops today. now, you can see as they get to taint section, i know we're losing it behind the tree here, but you can see.

it's tough to ma these turns. >> oh, my gosh, yeah, even with the mobile transporters that are actually configured to do just this, to make these turns with these shuttles, because, you know, they have to move them when they get back to the kennedy space center from the runway where they land back over to the orbiter processing facilities, so this is the way they moved them when they get back to the kennedy space center, but we know, zoraida, "endeavour" is not going back to the kennedy space center. its home will be at the california science center, a temporary facility for the next several years while they continue to fund-raise and raise money because the permanent building is not ready yet. >> so you know what? that's why people need to come out and watch it. i was trying to take my kids to see the one coming through here on the hudson. they said it won't be ready for a highly so i highly encourage people to go and see it because this is the opportunity of a lifetime. can't wait until it gets lighter out. can't wait to see it. we'll see it more and more. >> sure. >> john, back to you. they went to bat for their

running mates, vice president biden and congressman ryan tackled their issues in the one and only debate. we will look at the highlights next.

>> mr. vice president, i know you're under a lot of duress to make up lost ground. >> jack kennedy increased growth. ronald reagan -- >> now you're jack kennedy. >> a battle of minds. congressman ryan and vice president widen go head to head in the first and only vice presidential decade. we dig into the facts and fiction ahead. >> malarkey complaining, laughless, shirtless, just a few

of the top search items on google during last night's debate. we have more on the debate coming up this hour. >> shirtless. >> shirtless what, could be better than that. >> welcome back to "early start." >> it's friday, october 12th. there was plenty of passion and paul ryan and joe biden each got in a zinger or two but no knockout last nighin the vice presidential debate. nobody had a bad night and nobody was too polite, that's to be sure. joe biden was the aggressor and paul ryan looking like the calm, collected counterpuncher. >> and here's how america scored it. a cnn orc poll taken right after the debate showed 48% of the voters who watched thought ryan won and 44% favored pieden. that's a statistical tie. senior congressional correspondent dana bash is live from danville, kentucky this morning. this debate had a lot of heated exchanges, jabs back and forth.

let's take a look at one of them. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and preserve important preferences for the middle class. >> notmatically possible. >> it is not mathematically possible. >> it's never been done before. >> a couple of times. jack kennedy lowered tax cuts and ronald reagan. >> looks like vice president biden had a lloyd bentsen moment. did his aggressive tone hurt him and help him? >> reporter: yes and yes. >> that's a goodanswer. let's start with the latter though, the helping him. his primary goal here was to get the democratic base who were really deflated after the last debate, after the president didn't from their perspective, most people's perspective come ready to play, to get them back up off their feet and ready to go to the polls and to work for the president and for joe biden. when it comes to that goal, hey, he hit it out of the park.

hurting him, for those, you know, whatever it is, 4%, 5% of undecided voters who were watching this saying how do i feel about this ticket and they saw him grinning and grimacing and rolling his eyes and -- and, you know, sort of just physically making some people potentially uncomfortable, that could hurt him. >> all right, dana. both candidates were asked about their stance on abortion. they gave very different answers, as you might imagine. well, we know that romney's position has long been that abortion should be legal in cases of incest and rape. well, ryan's past position on this become an issue at all? >> reporter: you know, certainly democrats try to, particularly when the whole controversy with todd akin, a republican is not candidate exploded because ryan in congress ha signed on to very, very strong anti-abortion language, legislation, but when

it came to the abortion question last night, i think what you were going to play was the fact that ryan really towed the romney line saying that the romney/ryan tickets believes that abortion should be illegal except in cases of rape and incest and the health of the mother. i think we have the sound bite, if we want to listen. >> i understand this is a difficult issue, and i respect people who don't agree with me hon this, but the policy of a romney administration will be to oppose abortion with the exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother. >> well, i guess he accepts governor romney's position now because in the past he has argued that there was -- there's rape and forcible rape. he's argued that in the case of rape or incest it was still -- it would be a crime to engage in hag an abortion. i just fundamentally disagree with my friend. >> all right. thank you, dana bash, down in

danville, kentucky right now. they are cleaning up the remnants and sweeping up the ashes from the incredible debate last night. want to get more analysis on what happened right there. i want to bring in anna navarro and republican strategist and a democratic analyst and former adviser to bill clinton. there was a lot of stuff back and forth last night, a lot of tense moments. let's just replay some of the stuff that we -- that we liked the most here. >> able to overrule their injections and put them in in spite of the administration. we can debate the timeline, whether it's that short of time. thank heavens we had those sanctions in place, in spite of their opposition. given 20 waivers. >> that's not how it's going. >> this is his two-minute answer, please. mitt romney is a guy car. they keep misquoting him but let me tl you about the mitt romney i know. >> all right. so the cnn orc poll immediately after the debate found it to be basically a tie, maybe paul ryan a slight edge, 48% to 44%.

anna, do you agree with those poll numbers or do you think there was a clear winner? >> i'm a republican pundit so i'm supposed to tell you i saw paul ryan crush joe biden but i took some truth serum this morning. i saw a draw. i think they both did very well and did what they needed to do. joe biden did a lot better than president obama and that's what he was being compared, to and i think paul ryan held his own against a very seasoned, one of the most veteran politicians in america today. they went to to toe, and i think the american people won. we saw a very good energetic debate where we saw two very clearly defined positions on practically everyish you a. >> so richard, you're a democrat, did you also drink some of that truth serum with anna? >> i missed the truth serum this morning. listen, i think that juden -- joe biden gets an a-plus from democrats. did everything he needed to do. all that face smiling,

everything he needed to do after we saw a relatively flat president obama. i do think representative ryan did okay. under very difficult circumstances, you know, he looked like someone who knew a little bit about what he was talking about, but when some of the stuff he says today gets fact checked it will not hold up as well, and i think joe biden was fantastic. >> one of the most important sentences you said there was democrats are happy, democrats are energized and one of the things we have seen in this election so far is turning somewhat a base election, which side wants to turn out for their side more. do you think, and i'll ask you both, do you think this was enough to get democrats back in the game mentally and emotionally? >> i think it was exactly enough, exactly what was required, and the interesting thing is going to be if barack obama can pull this out and get re-elected he'll owe it to two old-line democrats, joe biden and bill clinton. >> i think he did what he had to do, he stopped the bleeding. if we saw the way the polls were trending and the effects of the debate from the first presidential debate, tngs were going real bad real quick for

president obama and his camp. yesterday joe biden stopped the bleeding. now it's entirely on obama's and romney's court. it's up to obama to reverse the trend, but joe biden yesterday did stop the bleeding. had joe biden lost yesterday, today we would be giving his political owe by thery. today we would be saying it was the final nail in that coffin, but he didn't. we've still got a race on our hands. >> all right. let's go back to some of those moments from last night. joe biden did a lot of smiling. i want to play some of these moments and then talk about it. >> what we're saying, deny the loopholes and deductions. >> detected my frustration with their attitude about the american people. my friend says that 30% of the american people are takers. romney points out 47% of the people won't take responsibility. he's talking about my mother and father. he's talking about the places i grew up in, my neighbors in scranton and claymont.

>> so, guys, a lot of smiling there. >> so much smiling in that clip. >> this is when i start interrupting you like joe biden did with paul ryan, hardly get through a sentence. i could smile and see how that goes early in the morning. >> one time when he wasn't smiling. one time in the whole debate that he wasn't smiling in that clip you showed. i think he had to do that because president barack obama was so flat last week. you know, president obama just sort of sat there and took these punches. biden had to do something to show how incredulous he was, and that's why you saw all the smiling. i mean, he smiles anyway, but that's why i think it was so effective. it may have turned some people off, but the people he was talking to, people he was addressing, needed to see that. >> but you and i know joe biden, and it's hard to get a word in edge-wise with jiden. i think we saw some of that last night, and joe biden does smile a lot and does show a lot of emotion. the problem was last night a lot of that emotion was fake emotion, and he was, you know,

doing gesturing and facial expressions that were overly dramatized and were intended to be fake and i think it came across that way. would i have liked my friend joe to take this thing seriously and do a little less of the drama. >> can i tell you, i think he took it deadly seriously, and what you saw was real emotion. you saw the -- you saw the outragthat -- he shared the outrage of many democrats like myself who thought to myself what was president obama doing nothing last week and that's why you saw such emotion. that was real emotion. >> in the tradition of joe biden i have to interrupt you and i'll say my friend richard and anna, thank you for being ere. >> and i'll say our friends. we'll invite you back in the next hour. you can continue talking. fact versus fiction. vied biden and paul ryan threw out a lot of claims about medicare last night, but was it actually factually true? we're going to break it down. tridion safety cell oy which can withstand over three and a half tons.

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act right now. call the number on your screen now! ♪ [ male announcer ] gly nimble, ridiculously agile, tight turning, fun to drive 2013 smart. ♪ it is 47 minutes past the hour. after last night's vice presidential debate, many americans must still be wondering which party will better preserve medicare. both candidates claim their opponent's plan will leave millions of seniors down a slippery slope. so what exactly are the plans, and which one is better? time for a medicare fact check. here's tom foreman. >> reporter: good morning, john, zoraida. medicare, as you know, is a government health insurance

program for people mostly over the age of 65. about 50 million americans depend on this program, and its long-term financial future is pretty shaky, but here's the really scary part. each campaign says the other side's plans for dealing with it are terrible. >> obama care takes $716 billion from medicare to spend on obama care. >> all you seniors out there, have you been denied choices? have you lost medicare advantage. >> they haven't put a credible solution on the table. >> their ideas are old, and their ideas are bad, and they eliminate the guarantee of medicare. >> this is the essential claim that my opponent will destroy medicare. is that really true. let take a look at some of the facts. i'll bring in some tools here and look at the white house plan to begin with. this is the landscape they are dealing with. the cost of medicare is going to generally increase over the next ten years until it reaches about $1 trillion annually.

they want to reduce that by about 10%. that's the orange part here. that's the part they are cutting out. now, their opponents look at that and say that's real care for real people that you're getting rid of, and you just can't do that, but the white house says hold on, no, it's not. that's a reduction in the amount of money that we're paying to the administrative costs, of hospitals and to insurance programs. in a word they say that is waste. we can get rid of it, and we should get rid of it. that's the white house take on things. now, if you bring in the romney/ryan plan you'll see the landscape is just the same, the same increase. they also want to reduce it by about 10%, but they want to rely on the private sector, not government, to get that ne. in a word they are going for vouchers. now, they don't like calling it vouchers, but that's really what it is. right now if you're on medicare, what happens is the government pays medicare. medicare pays the hospital. the hospital takes care of you. under this plan the government

would pay you, and you would decide if you wanted to buy into medicare or into private insurance. that will create competition between the two, and their theory, and that is how you get at that very same waste that the white house wants to get at. these are two very complicated, huge programs. there are critics on both sides who say this plan won't work or that plan won't work, or this plan will leave people stranded and that plan will leave people stranded. it's complicated and hard to deal with. go to the basic claim that both sides raise that somehow this is all about destroying medicare that is simply false. that is a scare tactic no matter which side is saying it. so why are they saying it so much? all you have to do is look at the map, and you know. across the country the baby boomers are getting older. they are becoming a bigger percentage of the voting population fast. all those dark states is where the percentage is highest. look at florida, battle ground state. more than 17% of the population there is over the age of 65.

these are engaged voters. they are voters who show up when it's time to vote, and they are very concerned about medicare, even though both sides say neither plan is going to affect people over the age of 65 right now. they are engaged on this issue, and whichever side wins the medicare debate will probably win a lot of senior votes. >> all right. our thanks to tom foreman with very cool graphics there. 5:51 right now. malarkey, conflating, shirtless, that's just a few of the top search terms on google during last night's debate. we have google's election team coming up live, next. ♪

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all right. welcome back, everyone. 54 minute after the hour. so move over, big bird. the latest online debate trending buzzword is malarkey.

>> with all due respect that's a bunch of malarkey. >> so what else was burning up thenternet during last night's vice presidential debate? abbey tattin closely monitored the trends immediately after with the google trends. we know malarkey trend and what other breakout trends? >> when people are looking at the google searches happening in realtime around the debate one of the main things is people were trying to figure out what is the vice president talking about because it was malarkey, but it was also the word conflating which biden used in the first hour, and i think people were really trying to figure out. you could see people asking on social networks is that a word? maybe not one that they had heard before so people using google as a dictionary a little bit, and the other thing that we see throughout the debates is people want to know what other people think about who is winning, so who is winning the debate is another one of the breakout searches last night. >> one of the things i also like

that you did so interesting, you combine -- you find out what they searched with in conjunction to the candidate's name. >> exactly. when you're searching on google not always putting in somebody's name, right? put it with bio or issue or whatever it might be, so for both the candidates last night as they were talking, there were two things. people wanted to know with the other person in the debate. people wanted to know the ages of these two candidates. very different ages there on stage, but then looking at the differences between the two searches were pretty interesting. for vice president joe biden people wanted to know about him laughing. he did that a few times during the hour and a half last night and also about jill biden, dr. jill biden. very different for paul ryan. paul ryan shirtless, paul ryan workout. these are search terms that paul ryan cannot shake. as son as he was mentioned for the running mate, shirtless has been one of the leading related searches. >> during the debate, people are saying paul ryan shirtless. >> talking about afghanistan, iran, the ayatollahs and people

are searching what does he look like without his shirt on. >> such a big deal everybody is talking about it. i must admit that i also googled it because everybody -- this was early on though. anyway, how do these terms compare to last week? >> well, they were -- there's been a lot of interest, and i think it's just building and building. i think one thing that was interesting about last night taking a step back and not just looking at the debate but searches in general around the country, how they compared to pop culture and entertainment, the vice presidential debate last night was more search than things like miley cyrus and baseball, so people are really getting interested in this election at this point. >> wow. >> abbi tatton from google, nice to see you here, our old friend from google. thanks very much. and we will be right back with something awesome. count on it. wahlalalalallala! pepper, but not pepper, i'm getting like, pep-pepper. it's kind of like drinking a food that's a drink, or a drink that's a food, zip zip zip zip zip! i'm literally getting zinged by the flavor. smooth, but crisp. velvety.

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morning after the vice presidential debate and there's a lot of talk about paul ryan pumping iron. it's our late night laughs. >> this is a big -- today, "time" magazine published a bunch of pictures of paul ryan working out. have you guys seen these? take a look at this one here. yeah! right there. is is one that really got me. i like this one. next vice president of the united states! looks like screech from saved by the bell, doesn't it? backwards hat.

come to the debate. stay for the gun show. >> pages taken as part of a shoot that would have been published if ryan was picked as "time's" person of the year last year. why would he make this his person of the year photo? looks like the after shot on a billboard for lap band surgery. and why would he pose like this? i wouldhonestly rather have a sex tape released than these -- that picture, he looks like a backup dancer for 'n sync there. a guy who guards the keg at a frat party. i love the backdrop here. because it looks like he's working out in a sears portrait studio or something. this one is the best. this is the poster -- this is a poster rush limbaugh has hanging over his bed. >> all right. the intense fascination is because he works out to p-95x which is really an intense workout. but that's -- >> that's why you're googling him shirtless. >> i did it for my job. >> "early start" continues right

now. that's a bunch of malarkey. >> i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. it appears a sometimes funny debate from the vice presidential nominees. just how accurate were their statements? this morning we're going to drill down on the facts. >> and the space shuttle enerr is on the move in los angeles. we're going to go live to the streets of l.a. straight ahead. >> good morning, and welcome to "early start" everyone, i'm john berman. >> and i'm zoraida sambolin. 6:00 a.m. in the east. >> that special music means, america has spoken. you declared last night's bruising bare knuckles debate between paul ryan and joe biden a draw. unlike last week's presidential face-off, this debate had passion. >> a lot of it. >> the vice president sure came out firing. paul ryan seemed mostly to keep

his cool. and he calmly countered. >> so let's check the score cards, shall we? a cnn/orc poll shows 48% of voters who watched thought ryan won. 44% favored biden. so this is a statistical tie. senior congressional correspondent dana bash live from danville, kentucky this morning. she was in that room behind her. and she's joining us live this morning with all of the details. good morning. >> good morning, zoraida and john. i was in this hall. it was really packed with energy from the beginning all the way through the 90 minutes of the debate. there were some grins and grimacing. a lot of that on the left. there was some smirking on the right, as well. all in all it was a very substantive debate on the issues of the day. these were two men who both came ready to tangle. on taxes. >> you can cut tax rates by 20%. and still preserve these important preferences for

middle-class taxpayers. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. >> reporter: -- on medicare. >> they just allow medicare to bargain for the cost of drugs like medicaid can that would save $156 billion right off the bat. >> it would deny seniors choices. >> reporter: on the president's foreign policy. >> when we look weak, our adversaries are much more willing to test us, they're more brazen in their attacks and our allies are less willing -- >> with all due respect that's a bunch of malarkey. >> reporter: the vice president appeared determined to make up for president obama's mistakes last week. almost imediately launching the attack lines obama never used in his debate. >> it shouldn't be surprising for a guy who says 47% of the american people are unwilling to take responsibility for their own lives. my neighbors, they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. >> reporter: before the debate, cnn was told paul ryan's team anticipated biden being aggressive where the president was not. especially on mitt romney's infamous 47% remark.

>> romney's a good man. >> reporter: ryan was ready with a well-practiced retort. >> with respect to that quote, i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. >> i always say what i mean. >> reporter: biden's recovery plan for a demoralized democratic base was not just in what he said, but what he did. >> in spite of their opposition -- >> oh, gosh. >> reporter: the president was criticized for not interrupting. >> biden jumped in cotantly. >> as a result of this -- >> it's -- whoa, whoa, whoa. >> mr. vice president -- >> reporter: the president was slammed or nodding as romney spoke. biden used the split screen to give a running commentary of disapproval with his facial expressions. ryan had a zinger ready for all that, too. >> i know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground. but i think it will be better served if we don't keep interrupting each other. >> reporter: for 90 minutes,

voters saw two dramatically different visions on the economy -- >> the last people who need help are 120,000 families for another, another $500 billion tax cut over the next ten years. >> our entire premise of these tax reform plans is to grow the economy, and create jobs. >> reporter: to national security threats, like a nuclear iran. >> and if they get nuclear weapons, other people in the neighborhood will pursue their nuclear weapons, as well. >> war should always be the absolute last resort. >> reporter: for the most part, it was a substantive debate between two longtime lawmakers, who tried to disagree without being too disagreeable. >> when my friend talks about -- >> reporter: biden avoided any trade mark gaffes, but did provide a little levity. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look, here's the deal -- >> what does that mean a bunch of stuff? >> well it means it's simply inaccurate. >> it's irish. >> we irish call it malarkey. >> reporter: john and zoraida, a big part of the debate, or the

spin in the spin room, which of course goes on right after these debates, is whether or not joe biden was rude and over the top, as you heard from republicans. or whether he was just simply passionate and just joe, as the democrats said. but all of this is going to maybe be history in just four days. because that is when the presidential debate is. and before i go back to you, john, i just have to tell you that i just, while we were in that piece, saw your old friend from that other network, martha raddatz, and i think maybe she was one of the winners at that debate. >> i think "the washington post" actually called her the winner of the debate, as well. dana bash, thank you so much for that report. >> want to bring presidential campaign debate adviser who has worked with mitt romney as well as john mccain in 2008. he's also worked with george w. bush and congresswoman michele bachmann. he is a debate expert. great what was your first reaction tonight? >> my first reaction was that

the debate was a lot more fiery than the debate the prior week. both came to the debate ready to advance their positions, ready to defend and both were very aggressive in doing so. i thought the debate was a lot more lively. >> the question is joe biden came in very lively in some cases. talking, and interrupting. there's been talk about all of his smiles putting in. let's listen to, well, do you think it was too much? >> i think that, you know, the vice president wanted to show that he was willing to fight. i think that's why, you know, his side of the partisans will be very happy with his performance. but, i think the folks in the middle and paul ryan's side may think his performance may have been a little bit over the top in terms of interrupting, rolling the eyes, the sighs. it was almost like having an al gore moment in that debate. >> but to be clear, brett, you

know, obama campaign advisers have been telling cnn, we"the n this was a strategy. they did not want to let the romney/ryan team get away with what they got away with last week, uninterrupted claims. i want to play you one little section here where joe biden, and paul ryan really got going on the tax cut issue. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and still preserve this important preferences for middle-class taxpayers. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. it's been done before. it's -- >> it has never been done before. >> it's been done a couple of times. >> it has never been done -- >> -- lower tax rates increase growth. >> now you're yak kennedy. >> that's really a perfect example and encapsulates a lot of what went on in this debate. there was substance, but there were also deliberate style things you saw there. what do you take from that? >> obviously was a preplanned strategy on the part of the obama campaign to have 44 joe

biden do the exact opposite of the president, be aggressive. that highlights the experience versus the youth. i think, you know, getting him to have a jack kennedy moment, which paul ryan didn't take the bait on. so, you know, i thought the vice president, you know, even broke the rule of honor -- of arguing with the moderator, which, you know, you don't argue with the moderator unless you're newt gingrich. so, i think that the vice president may have crossed the line at some places in the debate in terms of interrupting, being rude. but, you know, it was all in all a very spirited debate. and i think the format, and the moderator served it well in terms of letting them go back and forth. >> but just in closing here, if the goal was to rally the base for joe biden, did he achieve that? >> he certainly achieved that. i mean, he had to have inspire his base to know that, you know, last week, i'm sure many democrats were disheartened that

the president was unwilling to go out and fight for his cause. and so, joe biden definitely, the vice president definitely rallied his base with his performance last night. as you saw in how the poll numbers shook out. equally, paul ryan, also showed that he has the mettle to be the vice president. and that's what he needed to do last night, as well. >> brett o'donnell, always great to talk to you like this. no one knows debates like you do. >> all right, both sides went into full spin mode after the debate. everything was under the microscope. ryan's level of experience, biden's interruptions, and his facial expressions. check it out. >> i think congressman ryan was out of his depth and showed clearly that ticket is not ready for prime-time on foreign policy. i think that was a decisive difference between the two sides. >> i thought it was a great night for us. i was excited for paul. he was solid. he had a command of the issues. quite frankly i was embarrassed for the vice president. i mean the laughs. we counted 82 times that joe biden interrupted paul ryan.

>> if the only criticism comesing from the right and from some folks out there is that he smiled too much, i'll take that any day. my father was enjoying the opportunity to debate congressman ryan on a very important issue. >> all right. we have another debate fact check, not about smiles. this time about mitt romney's tax plan. they fought a lot about taxes last night. paul ryan claimed you could have 20% income tax rates across the board remain deficit neutral without eliminating deductions that benefit the middle class. >> you can cut tax rates by 20%, and still preserve these important preferences for middle-class taxpayers -- >> not mathematically possible. >> it is mathematically possible. >> such a good exchange there. what are kt facts? the nonpartisan tax policy center tells us, again they told us last night, given what we know about mitt romney's plan, it's not possible to cut tax rates as much as he'd like without eliminating deductions that would affect the middle class. they say you can't do that without changing the rules on capital gains taxes, investment taxes, dividend taxes with the

romney campaign says it will not do. so our verdict is here, according to the tax policy center, false, this cannot be done. wa to talk now about some other issues here. the auto bailout. the vice president made the claim, as the president has, that mitt romney said, quote, let detroit go bankrupt. >> we knew we had to act for the middle class. we immediately went out and rescued general motors. we went ahead and made sure that we cut taxes for middle class. and in addition to that, when that occurred, what did romney do? romney said no, let detroit go bankrupt. >> so here are the facts. on november 18th, 2008, mitt romney penned an op-ed in "the new york times" that editors there titled, "let detroit go bankrupt." though romney never used those words in that piece. in the piece, he opposed a federal bailout of the industry. but he did call for a managed bankruptcy of the auto company. something that, by the way, the obama administration essentially ultimately implemented. so, by the letter here, our

verdict is misleading. mitt romney never said at that point, let detroit go bankrupt, even if he supported a managed bankruptcy. but remember, he did oppose the bailout or direct investment into gm and the auto industry, which a lot of people think saved the industry. i want to make one more point before we move on. the obama campaign did send me a clip last night of mitt romney saying let detroit go bankrupt but that comes 23r 2011, well after the bailout debate was all said and done and the bankruptcy had already occurred. finally, will obama care force people to lose insurance coverage? paul ryan said obama care will cause 20 million people to lose their insurance. >> look at all the string of broken promises. if you like your health care plan, you can keep it. try telling that to the 20 million people who are projected to lose their health insurance if obama care goes through. >> so the facts here. congressional budget office analysis this past march mentioned an outside possibility of 20 million people losing coverage due to the law but it was part of a range of possibilities that also included

the possibility that 3 million people might actually gain coverage. it concluded, in the conclusion of the congressional budget office and the joint committee on taxation, a sharp decline in employment based on health insurance as a result of the american care act is unlikely. so our verdict here is false. paul ryan really went out on a limb there. >> i'm glad you did that. because i actually read the transcript, and oftentimes i found myself, and this was of the vice presidential debate last night, oftentimes i found myself asking, is that true? because if that's true, then it could be problematic. whether it was ryan or biden. >> the thing you have to remember with all of these fact checks here is there is an element of truth. these guys are twisting or taking studies that are out there, taking numbers out there and using them to their advantage. our goal is to try to figure out which numbers are the best to count on. which statements are the most true. and really give you the full perspective on what's being said. trust me, it's not easy. >> it's hard work. sometimes it's semantics. all right, 15 minutes past the hour. the nobel peace prize was just

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have more fiber than other leading brands. they're the better way to enjoy your fiber. 19 minutes past the hour. welcome back. we are minding your business. u.s. stock futures trading flat this morning. >> one thing that's going to go up this winter is your home heating bill. christine, how much we talking about? >> it's going to be cold this winter. the government tinking that it's going to be cold this winter and that means you're going to pay more even though the home heating oil prices aren't up a lot you're going to pay more because you're going to have more days of heating your home, especially in the northeast. $2500 is going to be your -- it's going to be the average price for homes specifically people in the northeast using heating oil.

up 20% from last year. but not -- the number of days with the heat on is going to go up 18% from last year. so you know, wear a sweater. to quote jimmy carter. now let's talk about other ways of heating your home. because not everybody uses home heating oil. natural gas, you can expect those costs to go up 15% this winter. propane, 13% and electricity 6%. that's the bad news. the good news is the international energy agency, with its big outlook for world energy prices says over the next five years, i think, demand is going to slow a little bit for energy, and that could keep a lid on prices in the longer ferm. we certainly hope that's going to be the case. the one thing you need to know about your money, mortgage rates are still super-duper low. they ticked up a little tiny bit. but a 30 year fixed rate 3.39%. 15 year fixed rate it 2.7%. if you're in the market to refinance, time is still good. all right. thank you christine. it is 20 minutes past the

hour. coming up the "endeavour" shuttle is heading to its new ohm. we're following its path through the streets of l.a. all morning long. but it's not traveling at light speed. super slow. 2 miles an hour i understand. these are live pictures for you. it's going to get a little lighter out there. we're going to have better pictures. >> they're stuck at an intersection. >> how often does that happen? we'll be back with that. there are a lot of warning lights and sounds vying for your attention. so we invented a warning you can feel. introducing the all-new cadillac xts. available with a patented safety alert seat. when there's danger you might not see, you're warned by a pulse in the seat. it's technology you won't find

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welcome back to "early start," everyone. okay, riddle me this, zoraida. what takes 48 hours to travel 12 miles, and it's not traffic on the 405 freeway in los angeles. the answer -- the shuttle "endeavour." the retired spacecraft is now snaking its way through the streets of los angeles, en route to its final resting place at the california science center. that's just how it rolls. cnn's john zarrella is watching this spectacle. he is live in los angeles. john, this has just got to be amazing. even by los angeles standards. how big is this thing? >> yeah, there's no question about it. you're talking about a vehicle that's more than 100 feet long, 78 feet wide, 145,000 pounds. and the carrier that they're moving it on right now weighs over 200,000 pounds itself. we are in an area by a shopping mall, which there's a parking lot here behind me, and you can see it's blocked off. they're actually going to put the shuttle in there. it's in a place between our two

camera shots right now, so we can't show it to you. but it's going to sit in there. they're going to reconfigure it on to a different transporter, and that's going to take about nine hours. so, it will literally sit here for the next nine hours before it starts to move on again, and head on ultimately two miles an hour, at 46 hours, the total journey. you know, flew 123 million miles over the course of 25 flights, john, and missions, and this is certainly by far going to be the shortest mission a space shuttle has ever made, and certainly the slowest journey one has ever made. but boy was it spectacular an hour ago when it literally left the airport, and was right behind us along the perimeter road there. as they moved out of l.a.x. where it's been sitting for the past few weeks, before it's making this journey to the california science center. and finally, john, they are telling people here in los angeles, look, tomorrow is really the day to go out and see it.

there are a couple of places by the old forum, and then at a shopping mall where they're going to be some festivities going on, some celebrations going on. there will be stands set up at those locations for people to go and watch it. today they're saying, just, you know, leave it be. let it do what it needs to do today and then tomorrow go out and watch it. but we did see quite a few people along the route already this morning who wanted to get that first look of endeavor making its final trip to california science center >> all right. >> john, zoraida? >> an unusual low-speed chase through the streets of los angeles. john zarrella, thank you so much today. >> sure. >> all right, 27 minutes past the hour. they went toe to toe defending their running mates. vice president joe biden and congressman ryan tackle the issues in their one and only debate. we look at the highlights coming up next. jack, you're a little boring.

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mr. vice president, i know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost groun -- lower tax rates increase growth. >> now you're yak kennedy? >> a battle of the minds among other things. congressman paul ryan and vice president joe biden go head-to-head in the only vice presidential debate. we dig into the facts and fictions. >> malarkey, conflating, laughing, shirtless. just a few of the top search terms on google during last night's debate. we have google's election team live on the show this hour. welcome back to "early start" we're happy you're with us. i'm zoraa sambolin. >> and i'm john berman. it is friday, finally, october 12th. >> poor guy. he's been up all night. so no one had a bad night. maybe you. >> except for me. >> neither candidate was too polite during last night's bruising debate. there was no knockout punch. but the two vice presidential candidates did manage to land some telling blows. joe biden, the aggressor. paul ryan the cool,

counterpuncher. >> here is how you, the voters, scored it. cnn/orc poll taken right after the debate shows 48% of you who watched thought paul ryan won with 44% saying joe biden was the victor. that is pretty much a statistical tie. our senior congressional correspondent and good friend dana bash is live from danville, kentucky this morning. dana, the candidates, they sure traded barbs on the stimulus. let's listen to what they said. >> and i love my friend here. i have -- i'm not going to show letters, go to our website. he sent me two letters saying by the way, can you send me some stimulus money for companies here in the state of wisconsin. we sent millions of dollars. you know why he said -- >> you did ask for stimulus money, correct? >> on two occasions we advocates for constituents who were applying for grants. that's what we do. we do that for all constituents. >> i love that. i love that. this is such a bad program, and he writes me a letter saying -- writes the department saying the

reason we need this stimulus, it will create growth and jobs. >> that was a moment there. will those letters come back to haunt paul ryan on the issue of the stimulus? >> you know, they kind of already are. when paul ryan was first picked by mitt romney, the democrats had a field day with that, because he was one of many republicans who were trashing the stimulus plan, and then wrote letters asking for money. i think that was one of the few moments, frankly, where joe biden got a punch in, and paul ryan didn't have much of a counterpunch. that and we were talking earlier, the other issue was when biden talked about the enormity of the spending during the republican years during the bush years. ryan generally talked about the fact that, yeah, republicans spent too much. he didn't even go there. that was one of those where biden got his licks in. >> social issues were also at play last night in a way they were not in the first debate. joe biden brought up the issue of the supreme court in an

exchange on abortion. >> the next prident will get one or two supreme court nominees. that's how close row v. wade is. just ask yourself. with robert bork being the chief adviser on the court, for, for mr. romney, who do you think he's likely to appoint? you think he's likely to appoint someone like scalia, or someone else on the court, far right, that would outlaw planned -- excuse me, outlaw abortion? i suspect that would happen. >> we don't think that unelected judges should make this decision. that people, through their elected representatives in reaching a consensus in society through the democratic process should make this determination. >> it really did seem that joe biden was eager to have that discussed last night. >> women, women, women. that was what that was all about. particularly when you're talking about those key women in some of the suburban areas, in the swing

states, swing districts, and swing states. that is what that was all about. reminding those, many of whom who are fiscally conservative, reminding them that from their perspective, if they are for abortion rights that there is a lot at stake beyond just the economy. and that is exactly what that was about from joe biden's perspective. >> it's really interesting to listen to two catholics having this debate, as well. dana bash, thank you very much. let's get some more analysis on the vice presidential debate. i want to bring in anna navarre row, republican strategist and a cnn contributor and richard socarides, democratic analyst and adviser to former president clinton. so, last night, who was the winner? did you see a clear winner? >> martha raddatz. >> there are many who actually agree with you. >> i have to tell you i think she did a great job. restraining joe biden, keeping him in a time frame is not an easy thing to do. i think she did a terrific job bringing in a lot of issues that were important. we saw for the first time the

two campaigns talk about benghazi correctly. we saw talk about social issues. it was a very good debate. the other winner was the american people. we got very well defined positions, starkly different, i think, from both camps. we've got a choice to make. >> i think it was a good debate. i think joe biden was clearly the winner. i thk it was a jolt of energy -- >> oh, stop drinking the democrat kool-aid. it's too early in the morning. >> i think you sew, we saw the cnn poll which showed pretty much a toss-up. i think the other polls this morning show that joe biden was the clear winner. and i think this was the jolt of energy democrats needed to get the momentum back. i think that's exactly what will happen. >> a clear winner but more importantly there was no clear loser. >> i want to talk about a poll. because you mentioned the poll. our poll shows more people felt paul ryan was more in touch with their problems. take a look at this poll. some wondered if ryan would connect with the people in this debate and it looks like he did. are you surprised by that poll?

51%. >> i'm surprised. and i think it's wrong. i think it will not hold up. >> those rigged polls? >> i don't think it's rigged. you do an overnight poll. you have a 5% margin of error either which. i think polling out of the other firms shows the opposite. there's a cbs poll which shows biden won by 11%. that's the kind of polling you will see. ryan did fine. i think he held his own. i think that he, you know, watched with the expertise, and the gravitas of joe biden, and the energy of joe biden, i do in the think >> and the age of joe biden. not easy to debate your father. >> for a vice presidential nominee the bar is to prove you could be president if you had to. any doubt that paul ryan met that? >> yeah, i doubt it. i don't want him to be

president. i'd be scared if he was president. >> i think you're in the mine or -- a lot this morning are saying he looked like he could hale it. >> you know, when it came to foreign policy he looked very robotic, i thought. i thought that, you know, he looked like he had a good training. >> when you listen to his answers, he splay looked robotic, but when you listen to the substance of his answers. >> i think there were a lot of questions he didn't answer. i think there were a lot of moments where he just kind of, you know, shrugged his shoulders. >> ana, let me ask you, martha, pushed paul ryan very hard on the specifics of the tax plan, the 20% tax rates, how do they pay foit. ryan really did not fill in the blanks there. will he have to at some point? did he satisfy you? will he satisfy us ever in the next 26 days? >> no, they won't. they're not going to get specifics. i think they got their answer. we're not going to give specifics because we've got some general points and we're going to fill in the details when we get elected by working with congress and making this a joint effort so it is a bipartisan joint effort with congress. but i think both of them brought

their "a" game last night. and i think both of them showed a lot of substance, and i think for both of them also showed their human side. i think we saw out of both of them. >> i'm glad both of you brought your "a" game this morning. >> really nice to have you. thanks for getting up nice and early after you stayed up really late. >> i stayed up late. >> she's in a very nonpartisan, bipartisan mood this morning. >> i'm just in a weakened state. >> so, good people. during the debate, what were people trending on the web in terms of searches on google? the top rising searches were, biden, conflating, malarkey, who is winning the debate, and how old is paul ryan. >> 42 years old, by the way. >> breaking down the top searches related to biden, ryan debate came in at number one. how old is, dot, dot, dot. then laughing and also jill. that's what people were searching in conjunction with joe biden. >> he is about 70 years old. just about. >> 69!

don't give him years. >> i was fascinated by the age differences, actually. >> so anyway. that happened. thank you. we're going to move on right now. we will have more news coming up in a moment. ♪

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43 minutes past the hour. soledad o'brien joins us now with a look at what is ahead on "starting point." another one who was up all night. >> yes, i was. and lots to talk about this morning. coming to you live, of course, from danville, kentucky. the site of last night's debate. a lot to tell you about. it was a feisty showdown as you've been talking about all morning. vice president joe biden, congressman paul ryan facing off. it's going to be their only debate.

they talked about everything from libya to health care to the economy. what was fact? what was fiction? we'll dig through that for you. we're breaking the night down with lots of guests this morning. chris von hollin will join us, mark zandi, moody's chief economist, ron johnson will be our best, delaware attorney general beau biden, son of the vice president will be joining us, as well. also protests around that courageous young pakistani woman. she was shot by the taliban. there are groups that are expected to take to the streets in support of her in opposition for the of the taliban in supporting her fight for women's rights. we're going to bring you all those developing details this morning as well, when "starting point" gets under way. >> all right, soledad thank you. let's get right to rob marciano with your forecast. good morning. >> good morning, guys. want to start off with tropical storm patty. still hurricane season, just east of the bahamas. forecast to drift that way. likely not to develop much more than it is right now. but we'll watch it very closely. hard to believe the fact that we've got frost on the ground, spots across the northeast.

and this leading edge of precip with a little bit of snow at the higher elevations, the next front that will bring a reinforcing shot of cool air. a lot of lightning strikes there, and also some. this piece of energy which had tornado warnings in parts of new mexico and arizona this morning, flooding as far north as nevada and southern utah, will bring some snow to the higher elevations as well. that chunk of energy will come out into the plains as we go through tomorrow and meet up with that front pushing east. look for severe weather not only today but tomorrow across the central plains. that may spell isolated tornadoes and potentially some damaging wind and large hail. highs today 55. chicago 55. a chilly night tonight. and a frosty wake-up call across the twri state area of new york city tomorrow. may want to sleep in, and wait until things warm up in the afternoon. guys, back up to you. >> such great advice. thank you very much, rob. 45 minutes past the hour. new this morning, a new u.s. ambassador reporting for duty in libya. the white house recalled veteran diplomat lawrence pope to serve

temporarily as a senior envoy in libya. the appointment comes a month after ambassador chris stevens died in the benghazi consulate attack. pope retired from the foreign service 12 years ago. happening right now at this very moment, the space shule "endeavour," five stories tall with a 78 foot wing span is squeezing its way through the streets of los angeles. two mile an hour crawl began overnight at los angeles international airport. "endeavour" is headed to its retirement home at the california science center. this 12-mile trip it's on right now expected to be completed by sometime tomorrow night. and it is a vision. >> photographers on hand. 84 million wrist bands with the phrase livestrong have been distributed by lance armstrong's cancer charity. critics of the legendary cyclist are crossing out the "v," sayings phrase should really read lie strong. armstrong has long been dogged by accusations of doping. on wednesday the u.s. anti-doping agency released more

documents that it says show beyond a reasonable doubt that armstrong cheated. and tonight, armstrong's former teammate tyler hamilton, will be a guest on anderson cooper 360. hamilton just wrote a book where he outright accuses armstrong of doping. >> man, so many great questions. that will be interesting. all right it is official. michael vick owns a dog. this revelation comes three years after the philadelphia eagles quarterback finished serving a prison sentence on dog fighting charges. in a statement vick says the dog is well cared for, and he wants his children to develop a healthy relationship with animals. all right. the detroit tigers headed back to the american championship league series. they shut out the oakland a's 6-0. justin verlander is very good. this was the decisive fifth game of the alcs. in the national league the san francisco giants, they completed an improbable comeback with a game five win over the cincinnati reds.

they lost the first two games at home and came back to win the next three straight on the road in cincinnati. now, the giants will be playing for the pennant. meantime, the baltimore orioles, thank goodness for the baltimore orioles. >> go -- >> sfoersed a fifth and deciding game tonight in the bronx. they beat the new york yankees 2-1 in 13 innings. never give up. never give up. another big game yesterday. a home run by jason worth. he gave the washington nationals a breath of life. a walkoff win against the cardinals. that sets up another game. we have game fives all around here. all four division series have gone the distance. ending in game five. playoff baseball, it is fantastic. >> 48 minutes past the hour. fact versus fiction. vice president biden and paul ryan threw out a lot of claims about medicare. but what was actually factually true? we're going to break it down. oh no, not a migraine now.

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welcome back. 51 minutes past the hour. after last night's vice presidential debate many americans must still be wondering which party will better preserve medicare. both candidates insist their opponent's plan will have tragic consequences for millions of seniors. so what exactly are the plans? and which one is better for you? it's time for a medare fact check. and here is tom foreman. >> good morning, john, zoraida. medicare, as you know, is the government health insurance program for people mostly over the age of 65. about 50 million americans depend on this program. and its long-term financial future is pretty shaky. but here's the really scary

part. each campaign says the other side's plans for dealing with it are terrible. >> obama care takes $716 billion from medicare to spend on obama care. >> all you seniors out there, have you been denied choices? have you lost medicare advantage? >> because they haven't put a credible solution on the table. >> their ideas are old and their ideas are bad, and they eliminate the guarantee of medicare. >> this is their essential claim, that my opponent will destroy medicare. but is that really true? let's take a look at some of the facts and consider it. i'll bring in some tools. look at the white house plan to begin with. this is the landscape they're dealing with. the cost of medicare is going to generally increase over the next 10 years. to about $1 trillion annually. they want to reduce that by about 10%. that's the orange part here. that's the part they're cutting out. now, their opponents look at that and say, that's real care for real people that you're getting rid of, and you just

can't do that. the white house says hold on. no it's not. that's a reduction in the amount of money that we're paying to the administrative cost of hospitals, and to insurance programs, in a word, they say, that is waste. we can get rid of it, and we should get rid of it. that's the white house take on things. now, if you bring in the romney/ryan plan. you'll see the landscape is just the same. they have the same increase. they also want to reduce it by about 10%. but they want to rely on the private sector not government to get that done. in a word they're going for vouchers. they don't like calling it vouchers, but that's really what it is. right now if you're on medicare, what happens is the government pays medicare, medicare pays the hospital, the hospital takes care of you. under this plan, the government would pay you, and you would decide if you wanted to buy into medicare, or into private insurance that will create competition between the two, in their theory, and that is how you get at that very same waste

what that the white house wants to get out. these are two very complicated huge programs. there are critics on bh sides who say this plan won't work or that plan won't work. or this plan will leave people stranded or that plan will leave people stranded. but the truth is, it is complicated. so if we go to this basic claim that both sides have raised here that somehow this is all about destroying medicare. that is simply false. that is a scare tactic, no matter which side is saying it. so why are they saying it so much? all you have to do is look at the map and you know. across the country, the baby boomers are getting older. they're becoming a bigger percentage of the voting population, fast, all those dark states, where the percentage is highest. and look at florida down here. battleground state? more than 17% of the population there is over the age of 65. these are engaged voters. they are voters who show up when it's time to vote. and they're very concerned about medicare. even though both sides say neither plan is going to affect

people over the age of 65 right now. they're engaged on this issue, and whichever side wins the medicare debate will probably win a lot of senior votes. >> all right. coming up. >> we have some fantastic best advice. how to live your life according to new orleans saints quarterback drew brees. >> ooh. >> everybody wants to know that. [music: artist: willy moon song: "yeah yeah" label: universal] ♪ everybody well don't you know it's me now? ♪ ♪ yeah who's it, who's it huh? ♪ ♪ willy's back with a brand new beat now, ♪ ♪ yeah doin' it doin' it up! ♪ heyyy yeah, tryin' to bite my style! ♪ ♪ heyyy yeah, how you like me now? ♪ ♪ na na na na na na na na ♪ and everybody go uh! ♪ playing a lone hand ♪ my life begins today ♪

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took hours to work or made me drowsy. after allegra, i have the only 24-hour medicine that's both fast and non-drowsy. after allegra, i have it all. 58 minutes after the hour. >> as always we wrap it up with best advice. romans. >> drew brees. today's best advice comes from new orleans saints quarterback drew brees. >> the best advice i've ever gotten is to never let anyone tell you that you can't accomplish something that you're willing to work for. >> hmm. >> that's a dude who should know. >> always work so hard in sports. >> nice guy, too. >> all right. enjoy the football this weekend. that is all frr "early start." i'm john berman. >> and i'm zoraida sambolin. "starting point" with soledad o'brien live in danville, kentucky, starts right now.